LD Rankings

This is a ranking of Lincoln Douglas debate teams.

Recently, we have received a lot of feedback that our rankings system has been disproportionately weighting smaller tournaments and high win-loss ratios for debaters that haven’t competed much. We take feedback very seriously, and we have made a series of changes that we believe will make the rankings more accurate:

  • We are only including tournaments that have a semis, octos or quarters bid to the TOC.
  • We will include player-decay in our rankings. The rating of a debater that competes less often will slowly diminish.
  • For a debater to be included in the rankings, they must have competed at at least two tournaments in their career. This increases the likelihood that a debater’s rating is representative.
View information about the rankings.
The algorithm used for these rankings is the Glicko-2 ratings system, a variation of the Glicko system. The basics of the system are simple: each debater starts out with a rating of 1500. Your rating is based on the result of every round you debate, weighted by the rating of your opponent and (for elimination rounds) by the margin of victory. If you win a round, your rating increases; if you lose a round, your rating decreases. Defeating a high-ranked opponent provides a larger boost than beating a low-ranked opponent, and losing to a low-ranked opponent yields a larger drop than losing to a high-ranked opponent. Every round counts.

We switched from the Elo system to the Glicko-2 system for the 2016-2017 season. While the two systems are quite similar, Glicko-2 system weights the effect of each round based on the reliability of the ratings of each debater. This change will correct for problems that arise in Elo when some teams compete in rated tournaments more often than others. More details are available here.

Ratings do carry over from season to season for debaters as long as they continue to compete.

These rankings do not claim to be a definitive ranking of all debaters, and are, admittedly, simply a minor contribution to the speculation and conversation that exists among some “national circuit” debaters and coaches. While we try to stick to data instead of opinion in our rankings, we do understand that the nature of debate is subjective and sometimes random.. So, enjoy the idle discussion and potential entertainment that rankings can bring, but please do not put too much stock into their reflection of the accuracy into the quality or ability of any given debater.

If you think you see an error, please let us know at rankings@victorybriefs.com!


View the list of tournaments included from this season.
WDM Valley
Holy Cross
Heart of Texas
Capitol Beltway
Apple Valley
University of Texas
Isidore Newman
Dowling Catholic
Strake Jesuit
College Prep
University of Houston
Puget Sound
Golden Desert

Come work with the best Lincoln-Douglas staff in the country at VBI. With a 4:1 staff-student ratio, our curriculum focuses on one-on-one mentorship and drill-based lab instruction, supplemented with the widest variety of modular elective offerings. To learn more, visit VBIDebate.com.

Our other LD services include the Card of the Day and our classic topic handbooks.

Rank Debater Rating Record
1 Jack Wareham (Oakwood Secondary) 2137.75 40-2
2 Oliver Sussman (Cambridge Rindge and Latin) 2080.06 50-4
3 Alexander Zhao (La Canada) 2053.90 62-9
4 Evan Engel (Harvard-Westlake) 2002.46 70-10
5 Raffi Piliero (Harrison) 1985.33 81-15
6 Noah Simon (Crossroads) 1981.06 9-1
7 Sekou Cisse (Success Academy) 1971.16 63-9
8 Nina Potischman (Hunter College) 1954.34 31-6
9 Zoe Ewing (Scarsdale) 1943.94 48-11
10 Jonas Le Barillec (Peninsula) 1924.17 70-20
11 Richard Cook (Strake Jesuit College) 1917.95 59-12
12 Grant Brown (Millard North) 1911.06 27-8
13 Lavanya Singh (Mission San Jose) 1905.38 32-7
14 Ariel Azbel (Lake Highland Preparatory) 1902.75 57-14
15 Tj Foley (WDM Valley) 1895.25 38-10
16 Trent Gilbert (WDM Valley) 1887.16 43-14
17 David Min (American Heritage Plantation) 1859.92 26-8
18 Shruthi Krishnan (Greenhill) 1849.96 54-13
19 Connor Engel (Harvard-Westlake) 1847.75 39-15
20 Derek Zhang (Mountain View) 1837.48 39-11
21 Srivatsav Pyda (Harker) 1825.69 43-16
22 Lucas Clarke (Cypress Woods) 1824.42 53-14
23 Shankar Krishnan (Ridge) 1823.53 25-9
24 Morgan Grosch (Cedar Park) 1820.17 42-14
25 Zack Gelles (Scarsdale) 1820.16 25-9
26 Parker Whitfill (Phoenix Country Day) 1820.07 38-14
27 Gillian Zipursky (Scarsdale) 1815.93 41-13
28 Ryan Younger (Brentwood) 1804.44 38-14
29 Saavan Nanavati (Westwood) 1800.66 29-8
30 Indu Pandey (Harvard-Westlake) 1799.70 35-13
31 Jason Yang (Kinkaid) 1795.45 48-17
32 Xavier Roberts-Gaal (Walt Whitman) 1794.55 41-13
33 Aram Moghaddassi (Syosset) 1794.41 27-9
34 Kaushal Balagurusamy (Lexington) 1792.72 28-11
35 Muhammad Khattak (Lake Highland Preparatory) 1787.76 35-14
36 Briana Aaron (Newark Science) 1786.28 46-18
37 Ashish Wadhwani (Dulles) 1784.69 40-14
38 Matt Zinman (Harrison) 1782.40 41-16
39 Priya Kukreja (Millard North) 1782.24 7-2
40 Harrison Wang (Lynbrook Debate) 1774.20 36-9
41 Chaitanya Sayani (Dougherty Valley) 1769.52 45-16
42 Nelson Okunlola (Earl Warren) 1765.45 28-10
43 Chris Sun (Millburn) 1764.44 45-22
44 Danielle Dosch (Immaculate Heart) 1759.15 53-20
45 Varun Venkatesh (Lynbrook Debate) 1758.77 38-11
46 Whitley Perryman (Montgomery) 1756.38 22-7
47 Jordan Farenhem (Pembroke Pines Charter) 1755.15 19-7
48 Katherine Fennel (Stuyvesant) 1752.71 48-23
49 Ishan Bhatt (St. Andrew’s Episcopal) 1751.83 28-10
50 Jong Hak Won (West Ranch) 1749.26 49-16
51 Conal Thomas-Mcginnis (WDM Valley) 1740.75 35-14
52 Prachit Bhike (Mission San Jose) 1736.41 11-6
53 Tess Welch (Cy-Fair) 1733.87 27-11
54 Logan Reid (North Crowley) 1732.28 23-8
55 Nisarg Shah (Lynbrook Debate) 1724.00 34-15
56 Nirmal Balachundhar (Lexington) 1723.85 29-17
57 Lauren Singer (Scarsdale) 1717.93 35-15
58 Kyle Yuan (Collegiate) 1717.31 16-6
59 Jonah Wu (Syosset) 1715.71 22-9
60 John Michael Magloire (Chaminade) 1709.69 11-6
61 Zoe Posner (Bronx Science) 1708.23 25-10
62 Eric Wallach (Collegiate) 1703.78 19-6
63 David Moon (Collegiate) 1701.53 54-23
64 Michael Landau (Scarsdale) 1700.71 44-22
65 Ishan Gaur (Peninsula) 1698.28 30-15
66 Frances Zhuang (Palo Alto (Independent)) 1698.15 53-23
67 Sebastian Williams (Gilmour Academy) 1693.70 21-11
68 Jaya Nayar (Harvard-Westlake) 1691.86 39-20
69 Whit Jackson (Brentwood) 1689.91 28-10
70 Chakra Jonnalagadda (Cypress Woods) 1688.37 34-16
71 Vikram Kalghatgi (Ridge) 1685.30 21-12
72 Camille Caldera (Walt Whitman) 1683.70 27-12
73 Jack Briody (Byram Hills) 1678.81 40-19
74 Rithvik Seela (Lake Highland Prep) 1675.87 29-18
75 Siena Cabbage (WDM Valley) 1675.14 28-13
76 Matt Gofman (Hendrick Hudson) 1668.43 25-13
77 Matthew Chen (Strake Jesuit College P) 1666.24 42-21
78 Macalah Thomas (Cedar Park) 1665.17 43-18
79 Alexander Sipetic (Stuyvesant) 1660.95 27-13
80 Benjamin Wolf (Winston Churchill) 1658.14 18-10
81 Vishal Tandale (Thomas Jefferson HSST) 1656.10 6-2
82 Lindsey Perlman (Byram Hills) 1654.80 27-16
83 Michael Gao (Law Magnet) 1654.09 33-18
84 Javier Navarrete (Christopher Columbus) 1651.81 16-11
85 Stephen Scopa (Pembroke Pines Charter) 1650.96 14-8
86 Rishabh Shah (Westwood) 1649.88 17-9
87 Arlo Weiner (Oakwood Secondary School) 1648.20 46-27
88 Reed Weiler (Lexington) 1646.96 23-14
89 Spencer Paul (Harvard-Westlake) 1643.17 37-15
90 Ashwin Bhat (Sunset) 1642.42 34-19
91 Evan Mckinney (WDM Valley) 1642.40 23-11
92 Alina Kulman (Hunter College) 1641.65 4-3
93 Sammi O’Reilly (Harrison) 1640.19 12-9
94 Colin Fee (Palo Alto) 1637.96 51-26
95 Jake Davidson (Harvard-Westlake) 1634.01 24-12
96 Adam Keller (Nueva) 1633.96 27-15
97 Andee Song (Westford) 1633.45 4-3
98 Rohith Mandavalli (Westwood) 1632.79 20-12
99 Ray Xu (Harker) 1630.83 6-1
100 Alexandra Mork (Harvard-Westlake) 1630.42 46-22
101 Joshua Herrera (Strake Jesuit CP) 1629.66 44-25
102 Kenzo Okasaki (Rowland Hall St Marks) 1629.41 19-10
103 Brennan Young (WinChu) 1628.62 7-3
104 Kevin Li (Stuyvesant) 1624.95 27-20
105 Aysha Hafiz (Newtown) 1623.14 26-17
106 Emmiee Malyugina (Harker) 1622.10 41-21
107 John Boals (Apple Valley) 1620.46 23-17
108 Ari Pappaharonis (Edmond North) 1619.75 5-2
109 Charles Li (Strake Jesuit CP) 1612.50 36-20
110 Colin McKay (Gig Harbor) 1610.01 13-4
111 Jason Kraynak (Bellaire) 1608.97 13-7
112 David Calabuig (Pflugerville) 1606.17 4-2
113 Patrick Aimone (Servite) 1603.88 32-18
114 Nate Galang (Klein) 1602.00 11-7
115 Marie-Rose Sheinerman (Hunter College) 1601.82 18-11
116 Noah Garberg (Lexington) 1593.43 21-11
117 Lauren Cole (Harrison) 1593.18 40-29
118 Max Kanner (Isidore Newman) 1591.26 21-16
119 Chris Wang (Lynbrook) 1590.86 35-21
120 Pacy Yan (Stuyvesant) 1587.89 39-25
121 Brian Gu (West Des Moines Valley) 1586.45 13-8
122 Michael Kurian (Dulles) 1585.51 19-13
123 Julia Wu (Lake Highland Preparato) 1585.19 20-15
124 Grace Kim (Marlborough) 1583.30 38-25
125 Vishan Chaudhary (Harvard-Westlake) 1582.88 28-17
126 Natalie Isak (Scarsdale) 1582.67 18-10
127 Douglas Wickham (Loyola) 1582.54 35-25
128 Tammuz Frankel (Hunter) 1582.46 11-5
129 Ari Mostow (Oakwood Secondary) 1581.41 13-9
130 Jae-Kyung Sim (Seven Lakes) 1581.28 7-5
131 Carl Spana (Harrison) 1580.74 27-20
132 Aman Gulrajani (Tompkins) 1580.61 4-3
133 Jessica Zhang (Woodlands College Park) 1580.37 30-17
134 Rachel Maciariello (Montgomery) 1579.17 10-8
135 Zachary Vlessing (Pine Crest Preparatory) 1577.63 8-6
136 Andrew Gilmore (University School Ohio) 1576.64 4-3
137 Wesley Carter (Logan) 1575.91 9-4
138 Amogh Dambal (Westwo) 1575.60 6-5
139 Kyle Lleras (Marcus) 1575.28 6-5
140 Alex Bauman (Oakwood Secondary) 1574.76 16-10
141 Kumail Zaidi (Oak Hall) 1574.67 11-9
142 Abby Grifno (Westwood) 1574.09 15-10
143 Emma Blum (Brentwood) 1574.04 37-20
144 David Asafu-Adjaye (Newark Science) 1571.86 20-14
145 Shawn Dermer (Cypress Bay) 1569.70 17-9
146 Abhilash Datti (American Heritage Boca Delray) 1566.38 12-8
147 Lindsey McNamara (William T. Dwyer) 1562.93 12-9
148 Arjun Goyal (Byram Hills) 1561.89 20-13
149 Barry He (Palo Alto (Independent)) 1560.72 43-25
150 Amy Pu (Randolph) 1556.38 29-19
151 Maya Arora (Cape Fear) 1556.35 13-13
152 Nikhil Ajjarapu (Lynbrook) 1555.90 31-18
153 Kirk Wu (San Marino) 1555.79 18-12
154 Aaron Singh (Strake Jesuit CP) 1554.59 15-11
155 Ron Packin (Byram Hills) 1554.36 17-11
156 Gabriel Manak (Bronx Science) 1553.13 14-7
157 Nicholas Newton-Cheh (Lexington) 1552.38 14-12
158 Danny Frank-Siegel (Evanston) 1551.51 16-11
159 Sachin Shah (Lake Highland Preparato) 1549.38 20-13
160 Oluwatosin Agboola (Newark Science) 1549.22 24-18
161 Jason Chan (Arcadia) 1546.85 6-6
162 Darren Kim (Loyola) 1546.29 19-12
163 Adejoke Mason (North Atlanta) 1546.21 11-9
164 Manasi Singh (West Des Moines Valley) 1545.11 18-13
165 Faraaz Haque (Kempner) 1543.47 14-7
166 Farzaan Kaiyom (Reagan) 1542.99 28-19
167 Thomas Leavitt (Kempner) 1540.44 6-5
168 Rishabh Krishnan (Thomas Jefferson HSST) 1540.00 6-6
169 Brian Gu (WDM Valley) 1539.13 5-2
170 Manan Shah (Harker) 1539.02 4-3
171 Eric Deng (San Marino) 1538.16 20-13
172 Roshan Sadhwani (Holy Cross) 1533.87 20-17
173 Gabriel Hull (Evanston) 1532.26 10-9
174 Gabe Rivera (Clear Brook) 1531.91 2-3
175 Brian Siegel (Harrison) 1529.25 27-22
176 Kyle Kopf (WDM Valley) 1528.11 21-18
177 Lily Goldsmith (Marlborough) 1527.75 4-3
178 Andrew Garber (Cambridge Rindge and Latin) 1527.62 14-13
179 Edward Rastgoo (Meadows) 1527.02 25-16
180 Aman Patel (Southlake Carroll) 1526.54 15-14
181 Elizabeth Zhang (Princeton) 1525.85 7-6
182 Daniel Harris (Walt Whitman) 1525.65 11-9
183 Jackson Deconcini (Brentwood) 1525.61 36-20
184 Niko Battle (Kamiak) 1524.77 9-6
185 Varun Paranjpe (Mountain View) 1523.92 30-19
186 Henry Smith (Evanston) 1522.52 11-8
187 Jake Kunzler (Skyview) 1522.20 9-6
188 Arnold Jia (Millburn) 1521.00 22-19
189 Jacob Lugo (Winston Churchill) 1520.91 14-11
190 Jugal Amodwala (Westwood) 1519.78 11-10
191 William Park (Harvard-Westlake) 1517.01 12-8
192 Brian Zhou (Greenhill) 1516.04 24-20
193 Michael Tao (West) 1515.54 4-2
194 Steven Goldware (Lake Highland) 1515.27 15-12
195 Charlotte Diamant (El Cerrito) 1515.05 3-3
196 Nisha Rajasekar (Westwood) 1513.15 3-2
197 Toran Langford (Holy Cross) 1510.69 23-21
198 Mina Lee (Edgemont) 1510.68 23-21
199 Margaret Purcell (Northland Christian) 1510.07 22-17
200 Jasun Chen (University HS Irvine) 1509.73
201 Amy Santos (Presentation) 1508.28 15-12
202 Alan George (Klein Oak) 1506.34 15-15
203 Alexander Davis (Westlake) 1505.67 3-3
204 Tiffany Chang (Phillips Academy Andover) 1505.34 11-9
205 Serena Lu (Harker) 1505.00 22-18
206 Anya Poplavska (Lynbrook) 1504.73 24-16
207 Matthew Gross (Harvard-Westlake) 1504.38 25-19
208 Vasanth Venkatasami (Lexington) 1502.80 20-18
209 Hannah Koegler (Lake Highland Prep) 1502.67 8-5
210 Emma Herring (Prosper) 1502.48 9-9
211 Cassidy Condray (Edmond North) 1500.18 7-6

    Are Blue Key and Sunvite going to be included? Both used Speechwire, but they probably still deserve to be included in the rankings as there were quite a lot of good debaters at both.

  • Sotoni

    y r rankings only until 187, instead of 250?

  • guest

    lowkey confused as to why Rachana Jadala is ranked considering she graduated several years ago..?

  • jessica boone

    Are the results from the Ridge Debates going to calculated into this list?

  • hbv

    when’s UT posting?

  • aiosd

    these ratings are ridiculous. i’m sorry, but they’ve lost all credibility for me.

  • Semper Idem II

    This year, results for Florida Blue Key were recorded on Speechwire rather than Tabroom or Joy of Tournaments. With that in mind, Speechwire should probably be added to the tournament suggestion page. Also, here is a result Speechwire missed: David Min (American Heritage) beat Stephen Scopa (Pembroke Pines) on a 2-1 decision in finals.

  • wonderingstuff

    When will marks be included?

  • Ron p

    Ron’s name is actually spelled Ron Packin

  • s

    arlo weiner and alex bauman are ranked twice

  • The Tsar

    If you’re having trouble inputting Yale because of Tabroom’s failure to post the final round results, Oliver Sussman (Cambridge Rindge and Latin) defeated Sekou Cisse (Success Academy) on a 3-0.

  • Bob

    Why haven’t the 2016-2017 season results carried over?

    • Zach Kirsch

      They have. We only display this year’s record, but the ratings (and thus the rankings) have carried over.

      • Bob

        I don’t see people like Oliver Sussman on the rankings even though he debated last year.

        • As explained above, debaters do not appear until a tournament they have debated at this season is added to the rankings. The ratings from last year do carry over, but no one is displayed until they debate this year. This is to ensure that debaters who have graduated/quit are not displayed.

  • Justice

    Where is Raffi?

    • I believe debaters only appear in the rankings once they have competed at a tournament this season. Greenhill has not yet been added to the system.

    • Zach Kirsch

      Yeah, as Chris said, Raffi was in the rankings until he competed this year. Now that Greenhill is in the rankings Raffi is on the list.

  • aisjfioj

    out of curiosity do you know when the new ratings will be up? for example will it be up by voices etc

  • anon

    what’s happening with 2016-2017 rankings?

  • 7off

    Ari Mostow is ranked twice

  • RankingsPlease

    Hey can you all upload Columbia to the rankings please? Thank you.

  • Nelson Ok

    Will you guys be adding TFA state or churchill?

  • Whit Jack

    damus + usc?

  • So Blade

    Okay cool you added Berkeley and Harvard. Any possible ideas on UNLV? It’s a semis bid and it was over a month ago

    • Andrew Perez

      Nobody cares. This is stupid, and no, you will not be ranked higher than 100.

      • So Blade

        Oh thanks buddy, really appreciate that

  • txexes

    Will you be including Churchill Results in the data?

  • angrycalikid

    it’s been a month and Berk still isn’t in? and Harv


    remove isaac swedlow he is bad

  • The Archduke

    Jack Wareham, Jacob Ronkin, and Karan Choudhary are all listed twice under slightly different school names. I can assure you that there is only one of each of those who is prominent in Lincoln-Douglas debate.

  • JustAsking

    Will finals bid tournaments every apply?

  • debat

    Harvard ?? berkeley ??

  • Debater2

    Harvard and Berkeley?

  • Curiositykilledthecat

    When will Harvard be added?

  • eyyy

    Is there any way to include finals bid tourneys?

  • debater

    where’s UPS?

  • Little Frydman

    Alejandro Frydman (University School FL) graduated last year

  • Guest123

    University JR and NSU University JR are the same person. I think this happened to everyone associated with University School as well who debated at Lex (KC, GF, and ZL)

    • Guest123

      The same thing happened to Valley debaters. Trent Gilbert and TJ Foley are rated twice, and I assume the same happened to Dani Reyes and the other debaters from Valley at Lex. They are in as both WDM Valley and West Des Moines Valley

      • Guest123

        This happened again. Jacob Ronkin and Karan Choudhary and ranked twice. I don’t know if the same thing happened to the Valley kids because neither of them are ranked twice, but they might have been too

        • Debater123

          Also Jack Warhead is rated twice

  • DB8Er

    Lexington isn’t included in the posted LD Rankings despite stating it is in the tournament listings.

    • Debater2


  • question

    aren’t cps results on tabroom?

  • Anonymous

    When are the rest of the semis bids going to be posted? I see that only grapevine is right now

  • Anonymous

    When’s the next round of rankings coming out?

  • RamPradad2.0

    When will these be updated? I know it takes time, but this only contains like 6 tournaments and college apps are due and people would want to put their ranking on those.

  • joe

    Can we get an actual lder to input these rankings? I’m sure there are a lot of people who would be down. The pf ones always seem to be updated faster and its taking a really long time,especially for kids who want to use this for college apps,expanding past 50 could be really helpful.



  • kinkaid??

    hows jason yang on the list

    • Stop Hating

      Because he is good

  • bob

    Think you forgot Felix

  • Hunter Martin

    Why Isn’t Mikey Speiser Rank #1?

    • lololol, good one

      because mikey speiser is literally a dung wad

  • questions

    Do these rankings include last years results? And will it be expanded beyond 50 in the future

    • These rankings do include last years results. In most contexts t is common practice for ELO rankings to carry over between seasons. ELO is more accurate as more rounds are included.

  • Curious

    will new ranking be out for this year soon?

    • jnebel

      Yes they will!

      • just wondering

        Any guess for exactly what time?

      • boi


        • boi


        • much 3 u


        • kk boo

          too too

  • Anon1

    When do the 2015-16 Rankings going to come out, I’m excited to see my boy Jonas Le Barillec on there

  • Question

    Hey, someone already asked this, but do the rankings restart every year? Like if I had losing records last year, will they hold back my ranking this year? Thanks!

  • anonymous

    will the rankings restart for the new season or continue off of last year?

  • tadam omasi (not actually him)

    Sounds like a really bad idea to include locals in the rankings. The judging usually sucks. If we’re trying to compile rankings for real debate-flow debate-It makes no sense to include locals. It would probably be better to just include bid tournaments, from octos to finals.
    Unrelated question: Will a double-octos bid tournament ever exist?

    • Guest

      “Real Debate” and “Flow Debate” are not necessarily synonymous. Local, non-technical debate rounds certainly have merit. “The judging usually sucks” is such a huge generalization, have you even attended a decently run local?

  • Just Wondering

    Are the semis/finals bid tournament results going to be uploaded?

    • Zach Kirsch

      Yep! The rankings will be updated with all semis-bid tournaments in the next few days.

  • Confused

    Do these rankings take the NDCA tournament into account? If they don’t will they soon?

    • Zach Kirsch

      No they don’t, but yes they will soon!

  • smaller bids

    when will sems and finals bids be added?

  • permthedisad

    Emily Hu and Xinlan Hu are the same person. lul.

  • Master_Yoda


  • anonymous

    how are ram prasad, annie kors, and srikar pyda on this list?

    • Zach Kirsch

      Sorry, we inputted Stanford 2014’s results by accident. Everything’s fixed and updated now!

  • Graduated Maybe

    Sam Azbel, Dana Councilman, Claire Kueffner, Charlotte Lawrence, Travis Chen, Yael Caplan, Leah Shapiro, Salim Damerdji, Chris Kymn, and Ram Prasad are all ‘ranked’ despite being graduated?

    • Zach Kirsch

      Sorry, we inputted Stanford 2014’s results by accident. Everything’s fixed and updated now!

  • YODA

    congrats on being ranked Sam Azbel!!!

  • MR.Dipplestick

    Whats the third number in the records

    • Certain round robins have two judge panels. The third number indicates a tie (split) two judge panel.

  • Rank Lex

    Since Emory is already calculated in when will Lex be?

  • rankings

    Sujay Singh is ranked twice

    • rank

      Hes a very talented debater

  • why no newark results mang

    are you not not including the results for the newark invitational?

    • Chris Theis

      As explained above the current rankings only include Octos and Quarters bids. It is time consuming to enter tournaments so we have been working from the largest tournaments down. Newark will be included soon 🙂

  • Elo Ranking Questions

    When do you plan in expanding to all TOC bid tournaments?
    And eventually those local tournaments?
    And when the expansion does occur will it only be from expansion –> future or include past tournaments?
    Also will it re-start next year?

    Sorry for all the questions! This is a REALLY cool thing you all are doing! Thanks for the impact on the community!

    • jnebel

      1. As soon as we can, but unfortunately I can’t give you an ETA.
      2. After round robins.
      3. We will include past tournaments, at least from the present season.
      4. We do plan on continuing it next year.

      It is possible that extracting the massive amount of data (e.g., from locals) ends up taking too much time. We have considered a self-reporting system in which debaters just enter all the information from each round into a form, which you (at least sometimes) would have an incentive to do to boost your rating, perhaps with a strict policy against lying (e.g., banning people after some number of warnings) and a system for cutting out duplicates. But not sure about this: it would, for example, mean that people who never report their own wins but get their losses reported by others (e.g., because they don’t know or care about the rankings, which is totally fair) would be severely underrated. What do you think?

      • Elo Ranking Questions

        Thank you, sounds good. Sorry for the late reply I didn’t realize I wouldn’t get a notification.

        Yeah, I was very confused how you will be able to analyze all the local tournaments.I think a properly structured self-reporting system could work, especially if people are motivated to be ranked it could add to be beneficial to them.

  • jnebel

    We are still missing Crestian round 5. So if you won that round and know where to find the results, please let us know!

  • Rankings

    Voices is a quarters bid but isnt listed. Was it included in the calculations?

    • Chris Theis


  • William Park

    shout out to my boy Dario Madyoon for being ranked

  • Josh Roberts

    The records listed are overall (prelims + elims)? or just prelims? If overall, I assume a W in elims, regardless of if it’s a 2-1 or 3-0 just counts as 1 win, correct?

    • jnebel

      Right, they include both prelims and elims, and winning an elim round counts as 1 W regardless of ballot count. The ballot count enters into the rating formula in basically the same way that the goal difference index is used in the World Football Elo Ratings (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Football_Elo_Ratings).

      And of course these records are not people’s actual total records but only reflect the rounds in our current data set.

      • PSmith

        Is it possible to post which tournaments have been included in the rankings listed above? That would be very helpful.

        • jnebel

          All of the ones listed here: http://vbriefly.com/side-bias/. (For Valley, only prelims are included right now, but that will be fixed shortly.)

        • PSmith

          Thanks. Have you considered posting a link to the calculations by round and team as they do for similar ratings for public forum and policy?

        • jnebel

          We can do that next time. Thanks for the feedback!

        • jnebel

          (Still working on this, despite the update.)